"Steven Scharf" <CellAcademician@NOXXhotmailXXNO.com> wrote in message
news:vjn909kqfhjcb1@corp.supernews.com... >

> Verizon provides faster data service than T-Mobile,
> not sure what you mean by the data services are
> worse.
>

Tzones vs mobile web. I prefer the former. Also, global data roaming is a
big positive. The drawback is clearly speed and from what I've read
reliability.

> T-Mobile does have the advantage of being able
> to use the same handset for international roaming,
> though Verizon also offers GSM roaming if you
> get a GSM handset. T-Mobile's international roaming
> rates are better in the European countries, but Verizon
> covers a lot more places.

Great. See you in Gabon.

>
> What exactly do you mean regarding SMS? I use it
> all the time on my Verizon phone and don't have to
> establish any different connection.
>
When I used verizon sms and a call came in while establishing a data
connection on my 2235, it would roll to voicemail quite often. Tmobile
doesn't give me that problem.

> Yes the Verizon phone selection is poor.
>

Which is a huge deal to many of us.

> Every independent study on voice quality
> has shown CDMA to be equal to or better
> than GSM (in the U.S.). That said, I agree
> that all things being equal, GSM with a full rate
> vocoder will sound better than CDMA with
> a full rate vocoder. You could have a handset
> problem if you have echoing.
>

Even when it doesn't echo, I prefer the voice quality on tmobile. It is
clearer and doesn't distort like my verizon service does during peak times.
My personal opinion.

>
> [posted via phonescoop.com - free web access to the alt.cellular groups]

""RDT"" <taite@panix.com> wrote in message
news:bhg9uj$15d$1@panix1.panix.com...

> Remember, Steven, unlike John Navas, I am not a GSM shill. I like
> GSM because it sounds better. My first cell phone was a CDMA PrimeCo
> phone and I thought it was pretty damn nifty. But it never sounded as
> good as my GSM phone does. I agree that the lack of AMPS roaming is a
> problem which is why I am hoping that CDMA shills like yourself will start
> putting pressure on Qualcomm to either adopt the Nokia AMR 8k codec to
> replace the shitty EVRC. I promise it will make your Qualcomm stock go up
> and you can go around bragging on your site that Verizon roolz and
> actually be speaking something resembling the truth.

Qualcomm does have a new SMV Vocoder that according to the tests
they posted sounds better than the AMR vocoder. However I tend to
take anything that manufacturer's or lobbying groups say with many grains
of salt. I think that they are fully aware of the fact that as GSM networks
are built out the coverage advantage of CDMA will disappear and that there
will be greater emphasis on voice quality. As long as subscribers don't
experience congested networks they couldn't care less about how
spectrally efficient one technology is versus another; it's not their
problem or concern.

Again, I caution that publications by trade lobbying groups need to
be looked at skeptically, but I will include the link:

http://www.cdg.org/technology/cdma_t...y_comparison_p
aper.asp

""RDT"" <taite@panix.com> wrote in message
news:bhg9uj$15d$1@panix1.panix.com...

> Remember, Steven, unlike John Navas, I am not a GSM shill. I like
> GSM because it sounds better. My first cell phone was a CDMA PrimeCo
> phone and I thought it was pretty damn nifty. But it never sounded as
> good as my GSM phone does. I agree that the lack of AMPS roaming is a
> problem which is why I am hoping that CDMA shills like yourself will start
> putting pressure on Qualcomm to either adopt the Nokia AMR 8k codec to
> replace the shitty EVRC. I promise it will make your Qualcomm stock go up
> and you can go around bragging on your site that Verizon roolz and
> actually be speaking something resembling the truth.

Qualcomm does have a new SMV Vocoder that according to the tests
they posted sounds better than the AMR vocoder. However I tend to
take anything that manufacturer's or lobbying groups say with many grains
of salt. I think that they are fully aware of the fact that as GSM networks
are built out the coverage advantage of CDMA will disappear and that there
will be greater emphasis on voice quality. As long as subscribers don't
experience congested networks they couldn't care less about how
spectrally efficient one technology is versus another; it's not their
problem or concern.

Again, I caution that publications by trade lobbying groups need to
be looked at skeptically, but I will include the link:

http://www.cdg.org/technology/cdma_t...y_comparison_p
aper.asp

In article <slrnbjqd2g.vtm.jra@dorothy.baylink.com>,
Jay R. Ashworth <jra@baylink.com> wrote:
>So don't go dissing CDMA -- or even a specific implementation thereof
>-- merly on anecdotal evidence. Other people have anecdotes, too.

My anecdote's bigger than yours.

RDT
--
"The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the
inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries."
--- Sir Winston Churchill

In article <slrnbjqd2g.vtm.jra@dorothy.baylink.com>,
Jay R. Ashworth <jra@baylink.com> wrote:
>So don't go dissing CDMA -- or even a specific implementation thereof
>-- merly on anecdotal evidence. Other people have anecdotes, too.

My anecdote's bigger than yours.

RDT
--
"The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the
inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries."
--- Sir Winston Churchill

In article <897%a.2477$f15.250749@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlin k.net>,
Steven M. Scharf <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
>Qualcomm does have a new SMV Vocoder that according to the tests
>they posted sounds better than the AMR vocoder.

Well, I've read the SMV sounds slightly better than EVRC (CDMA's
shittiest) WHEN it uses the full 8k. However, because it uses different
bit rates based on the dynamics of the conversation, it can actually sound
worse depending on the algorithm's ability to switch between the different
bit rates quickly.

By the way, I did yet another test of GSM side by side with CDMA just
to be fair. I think at 13k (instead of EVRC 8k), CDMA is acceptable
although not quite as good as GSM's EFR. It appears Sprint PCS will allow
you to change your vocoder to the old 13k. I highly recommend to anyone
who has CDMA to search the 'net for codes (for example, on the Sanyo
phones it is ##VOCODER -- two pound signs and spell out the letters for
VOCODER) to push your phone into 13k because the EVRC codec is really
shitty. They have done TOO much to decrease background noise and decrease
network congestion. EVRC is just unacceptable for any long conversation.

RDT
--
"The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the
inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries."
--- Sir Winston Churchill

In article <897%a.2477$f15.250749@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlin k.net>,
Steven M. Scharf <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
>Qualcomm does have a new SMV Vocoder that according to the tests
>they posted sounds better than the AMR vocoder.

Well, I've read the SMV sounds slightly better than EVRC (CDMA's
shittiest) WHEN it uses the full 8k. However, because it uses different
bit rates based on the dynamics of the conversation, it can actually sound
worse depending on the algorithm's ability to switch between the different
bit rates quickly.

By the way, I did yet another test of GSM side by side with CDMA just
to be fair. I think at 13k (instead of EVRC 8k), CDMA is acceptable
although not quite as good as GSM's EFR. It appears Sprint PCS will allow
you to change your vocoder to the old 13k. I highly recommend to anyone
who has CDMA to search the 'net for codes (for example, on the Sanyo
phones it is ##VOCODER -- two pound signs and spell out the letters for
VOCODER) to push your phone into 13k because the EVRC codec is really
shitty. They have done TOO much to decrease background noise and decrease
network congestion. EVRC is just unacceptable for any long conversation.

RDT
--
"The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the
inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries."
--- Sir Winston Churchill

What phone would you pick for Verizon?
Does if have to be tri-mode?

"Steven Scharf" <CellAcademician@NOXXhotmailXXNO.com> wrote in message
news:vjn909kqfhjcb1@corp.supernews.com...
> <e@x.com> wrote in article <rt6cnR17UvkgRKeiXTWJkg@comcast.com>:
> > I have verizon. I have tmobile. The service on verizon is not "far
better"
> > across the board.
> >
> > Pros: Wider coverage. Better in building penetration. Fewer connection
> > problems. Cons: lower voice quality, including frequent echoing. Worse
> > phone selection. Worse data services. Worse customer service. No
> > international roaming with your US handset. No sms without establishing
a
> > data connection.
>
> I can't comment on T-Mobile's customer service
> as I have never had them, but I have heard good
> things about them. Amazingly to me, Verizon ranks
> best in customer service out in California, but the
> surveys were before T-Mobile started service out
> here.
>
> Verizon provides faster data service than T-Mobile,
> not sure what you mean by the data services are
> worse.
>
> T-Mobile does have the advantage of being able
> to use the same handset for international roaming,
> though Verizon also offers GSM roaming if you
> get a GSM handset. T-Mobile's international roaming
> rates are better in the European countries, but Verizon
> covers a lot more places.
>
> What exactly do you mean regarding SMS? I use it
> all the time on my Verizon phone and don't have to
> establish any different connection.
>
> Yes the Verizon phone selection is poor.
>
> Every independent study on voice quality
> has shown CDMA to be equal to or better
> than GSM (in the U.S.). That said, I agree
> that all things being equal, GSM with a full rate
> vocoder will sound better than CDMA with
> a full rate vocoder. You could have a handset
> problem if you have echoing.
>
>
> [posted via phonescoop.com - free web access to the alt.cellular groups]

What phone would you pick for Verizon?
Does if have to be tri-mode?

"Steven Scharf" <CellAcademician@NOXXhotmailXXNO.com> wrote in message
news:vjn909kqfhjcb1@corp.supernews.com...
> <e@x.com> wrote in article <rt6cnR17UvkgRKeiXTWJkg@comcast.com>:
> > I have verizon. I have tmobile. The service on verizon is not "far
better"
> > across the board.
> >
> > Pros: Wider coverage. Better in building penetration. Fewer connection
> > problems. Cons: lower voice quality, including frequent echoing. Worse
> > phone selection. Worse data services. Worse customer service. No
> > international roaming with your US handset. No sms without establishing
a
> > data connection.
>
> I can't comment on T-Mobile's customer service
> as I have never had them, but I have heard good
> things about them. Amazingly to me, Verizon ranks
> best in customer service out in California, but the
> surveys were before T-Mobile started service out
> here.
>
> Verizon provides faster data service than T-Mobile,
> not sure what you mean by the data services are
> worse.
>
> T-Mobile does have the advantage of being able
> to use the same handset for international roaming,
> though Verizon also offers GSM roaming if you
> get a GSM handset. T-Mobile's international roaming
> rates are better in the European countries, but Verizon
> covers a lot more places.
>
> What exactly do you mean regarding SMS? I use it
> all the time on my Verizon phone and don't have to
> establish any different connection.
>
> Yes the Verizon phone selection is poor.
>
> Every independent study on voice quality
> has shown CDMA to be equal to or better
> than GSM (in the U.S.). That said, I agree
> that all things being equal, GSM with a full rate
> vocoder will sound better than CDMA with
> a full rate vocoder. You could have a handset
> problem if you have echoing.
>
>
> [posted via phonescoop.com - free web access to the alt.cellular groups]